Vent: Fans Who Give Fandom A Bad Name

[fangrrl_squees]

(and, by extension, drive me up the fuckin' wall)

This was provoked by a remark, elsewhere on LJ-land. As things are a little quiet at the office, I think I'll vent some spleen...

- Anyone with a stated mission of "freaking the mundanes". This ain't Fight Club and you don't have the right to try shifting someone's paradigm without engaging the clutch. Extra high-voltage lightning points go to anyone who cites being oppressed by organized religion / heteronormativity / the mainstream media as a justification for such behavior, as such reasons are utterly without merit.

(edit: I'd like to add that, yes, there is a difference between refusing to feel self-conscious about one's fannishness, particularly when in a fan-friendly environment - such as a convention - and deliberately setting out to upset someone)

- Related to the above: Cheerfully strutting your stuff is one thing, forcing non-consenting folks to participate in your exhibitionism fetish is something else entirely. Learn the difference and respect it. In my case, this one seems to crop up a lot at BayCon.

- Folks who fail to follow the 6/2/1 rule. Six hours of sleep, two meals, one shower - every day. Okay, sometimes it's more like 4/2/1 for some of us, but we try!

- Speshul snowflakes of any kind. You know who I'm talking about.

- Anyone who asks the question "Why...?" without understanding that the answer is almost certainly "Money". "Why aren't there more guests? Why did the con change hotels? Why did the registration fee go up?" etc.

- The fan who thinks their registration ticket and a seat in the conference room entitles them to engage whoever's on stage in a one-on-one conversation throughout the guest's presentation. You want rapport? Try cornering the poor sod in the bar, if you can. Otherwise let them speak. (For some reason, this phenomenon seems particularly bad at Alexander James concerts.)

- Anyone who buys into any us-vs.-them mentality within a chosen fandom. We're all fans, alright? Just accept that sometimes, we aren't going to agree. If you can't embrace the diversity, at least tolerate it. Extra high-voltage lightning points to the pompous fans who feel the need to explain to folks - in exquisite detail - why they're wrong, sad and deluded. Please, oh please, don't be Comic Book Guy.

- To quote Dave Barry, a person who is nice to you but rude to the waiter is not a nice person. Don't ask me why, but I've seen attendees at SF cons treat hotel staff in appalling ways - patronizing, dismissive, rude, high-handed and, of course, stingy when it comes to tips. If you don't want to tip waitstaff, don't go out to eat. And leave a tip for the maid who cleans your room, dammit. $2 per person, per day. If I can manage it, most of y'all can too.

Feel free to share your own little rants. We might as well get it out of our systems all at once...

Comments

[chiefted]

Don't ask me why, but I've seen attendees at SF cons treat hotel staff in appalling ways - patronizing, dismissive, rude, high-handed

If you see this please let the ConOps staff know. Honestly I don't know what we (or they when I don't work in that department) can do but it would be nice to know that, that has happened.

Least the hotel maven could be told

In my case, this one seems to crop up a lot at BayCon

Yah, there is one that sticks out in my mind at BayCon during our last year in the Double-Tree I remember and well wasn't happy in a "ok thats your thing, and well its my thing too but not in public and not where someone is going to get hurt"

(will now wait for someone, and don't know who it will be, jump my collective crap).

[kshandra]

(will now wait for someone, and don't know who it will be, jump my collective crap)

*snort* As if. You're spot on. Granted, there's a limit to what can be done - reminders of proper hotel etiquette in the program book/newsletter/etc. (Hm, maybe we should do a ribbon that says "Tipping: Not Just For Cows"). And if the Hotel Liaison hears about it, zie can talk to staff in the relevant portion of the hotel and find out if it was just rectal haberdashery on the part of the fan, or if there was some sort of provocation.

[britgeekgrrl.livejournal.com]

"Tipping: not just for cows" - I like it!

The gaming conventions I attend always make a point of including an 'etiquette' section - which includes how to behave towards hotel staff, reminder to tip the room maid, etc. I think it's a very good idea, meself.

[kshandra]

There was, in fact, a Fannish Etiquette panel this weekend, which I would have loved to attend...but it overlapped Match Game, so I couldn't. (To say nothing of the fact that scheduling that panel on Sunday afternoon is really locking the barn door after the horse has already been made into glue. :-P)

[britgeekgrrl.livejournal.com]

Alas, I fear that the folks who really need a course in fan etiquette... don't believe they need it and therefore wouldn't show at such a panel.

Put it in the program - right next to the programming schedule. That's what I say. :)

[iamradar.livejournal.com]

Only two people attended the panel (Jean and I were the panelists) so it was more of a roundtable discussion. I think if we 'advertised' the panel a little more, maybe it would have gotten more people.

[kshandra]

How many people were there to get? *wry smile*

[iamradar.livejournal.com]

There was a con staffer (I think he may have been there to make sure me and Jean were actually doing the panel) and a nice gentleman (I forgot his name) who has attended several parties with me and other friends.

Another couple showed up halfway through and talked about the delicacies of certain situations ("What should you do if someone smells REALLY FOUL?").

The panel was at 1 but we wrapped at about 1:45 as we ran out of stuff to talk about. We primarily chatted about the 6:2:1 rule, ribbon ettiquette, touching/glomping, respecting guests of the Con during their paneling (as well as respecting other con-goers during paneling), and not being antagonistic. (For example, the three shmucks last year at BayCon at the Hyatt who dressed in almost NC-17 bondage gear and went over to the side of the hotel where the Catholic Evangelists were having their conference...JUST to piss them off.)

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

(For example, the three shmucks last year at BayCon at the Hyatt who dressed in almost NC-17 bondage gear and went over to the side of the hotel where the Catholic Evangelists were having their conference...JUST to piss them off.)

Hence my growliness about folks who set out to "freak the mundanes" and/or forcibly share their exhibitionism fetish with non-consenting folks...

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

This is a good idea anyway for people from overseas where tipping is a foreign custom. I'd be very pleased to be told what's expected.

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

Good point!

*wonders if she should drop a line to the program-book maven at G1 and/or CT...*

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

Amounts are very useful because I'd be terrified of under- or over-tipping and making more of a fool of myself than usual. I even saw an Australian say she'd never go to the US because she had no idea about tipping and how to do it.

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

*nod* I've had a fair amount of luck looking such things up online before heading out of the country on general travel websites. Before my most-recent trip to the UK, I was all "I bet tipping customes have changed" - and they had!

But, yeah, something in the program book - particularly at those cons that *do* attract non-US visitors - that would be a good diea, methinks...

[txteva.livejournal.com]

Amen to this...
Although I think (from teh internets) that in US its more or less tip 10-15% all the time...

I'm still in UK tipping... you only tip at resturants who've earned it (ie weren't rude or a pain) and you do tip more for large groups... normally 10%

A nice taxi driver might get an extra 50p ($1) and a long stay in a hotel will leave the maid a few pound.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

[nods] The only tipping ever done here is for restaurants or hotels who have been especially helpful. I see I overtipped the taxi drivers then. Do you have to tip hairdressers? I was told yes, but I never did.

[txteva.livejournal.com]

Taxi Drivers... probaly £1 a trip (short one) is bout right... but since my taxis are at end of the night I'm always bit more stingy!


I do always tip hairdressers £1-3, it's worth keeping someone with sharp objects in a good mood!

I do always try to tip something at a resturant, thought I'd have no problem pointing out I wouldn't pay a "pre-added" service charge if their was poor service. That said, if it was poor service from the kitchen but the waiting staff were good we'd still tip them...

And a good trick is to tip a barman well (or buy them a drink) at the start of a busy night... gets you jumping the crowds!!

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

Thanks; that's very helpful! Not that I'll be back there very soon; it costs far too much just for the flights.

I knew about restaurants but just didn't have any idea about hairdressers. :-P They charge so much here anyway, they certainly don't need tips.

[britgeekgrrl.livejournal.com]

(edit: this is in the USA, I should add)

I always tip 15% at a restaurant, unless the service was actively bad, as Mr. Taxman assumes that waitstaff *always* get tipped 15% and tax them accordingly. Also, my mother was in food service for most of her life and if I stint, I'll get haunted. ;)

I tip taxi drivers 10%, because theirs is a suck job.

And I *always* tip my hair stylist 10% - 20%, depending on the service, because he's fabulous and always does a great job - and I want him to continue doing so! ;)

[iamradar.livejournal.com]

"Tipping: not just for cows"

I LOVE IT.

[kshandra]

There was a badge ribbon this weekend at SiliCon that said "YES to Reason - NO to Faith." I was particularly bothered by this one.... Faith is not the exclusive domain of the religious.

[chiefted]

Um least for me, ick, probably along your lines of ick.

Oh and if certain folks don't make the Special Snowflake ribbon,
I am going to.

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

No kidding!

As I like to tell folks, I have faith that electrons will continue to whizz around in their valence shells. I mean, really, it's not like I'm ever going to really *see* and electron for myself. But I believe they exist. :)

[kshandra]

Pre-freakin'-cisely.

[maudelynn.livejournal.com]

People who feel the need to tell others EXACTLY what they think is wrong with they're wearing.

People assuming just because popular guests are paying extra attention to someone that they are sleeping with them.

People thinking they are entitled to have a sip of my drink when I don't know them


People who think just because they have a mask on, it gives them the right to be a jerk

[kshandra]

People who feel the need to tell others EXACTLY what they think is wrong with they're wearing.

Unless, of course, they're the workmanship judge for the Masquerade. ;-)

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

Well... even then, there are certain ways one can go about the critique, imho.

In my few bouts as a workmanship judge, I've always tried to focus on what's praiseworthy about the costume, maybe *debate* a point or two with the costumer ("I would have used a different approach - can you tell me why you did as you did?") and generally don't share flat-out "I think X is wrong" type critique until/unless they ask for it and, preferably, not until *after* they've been on stage. Those folks are nervous enough as it is! ;)

[kshandra]

Oh, absolutely - you want the participant to come away grateful for the experience they had. We do our best to use the "$h!t sandwich" technique when reviewing mutant vehicle applications. "We love the idea of a mobile porcupine. However, a single row of zip-ties outlining the edges of your Ford Fiesta does not convey the image you're intending to present. We look forward to seeing your improved design at next year's event." Etc.

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

*sympathy*

You've mentioned you've had some real, er, "beauts" applying for mutant-vehicle permits...

[maudelynn.livejournal.com]

Perhaps but, in the cases I have experienced, it has always been random people walking around the halls

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

*nod* I'm familiar with the phenom - I just wanted to stick up for my workmanship peeps. ;)

Meanwhile, folk who cheerfully tear one's costume to shreds (er, metaphorically) when critique is neither wanted nor asked for deserve a kick in the shins...

[hystericblue42.livejournal.com]

It seems exceptionally rude to be an obnoxious fan just for the sole purpose of freaking out the mundanes. It's an interesting social side-effect, but it's not something a fan should go out of their way to do. Also, SHOWERS = VERY YES PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD.
- The fan who thinks their registration ticket and a seat in the conference room entitles them to engage whoever's on stage in a one-on-one conversation throughout the guest's presentation.
There was a guy like this in the bleachers at the Heroes premiere. He was asking questions as if he was a reporter. When I asked him if he was, he said no but he used to be and he still liked asking these questions. That would work if you were DOWN ON THE CARPET. But you are not, sir. You are SHOUTING FROM THE BLEACHERS. /end caps.

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

Y'know, I can almost sympathise with the folks shouting from the bleachers. I suspect they're just trying to connect.

Or maybe they're just fools.

I'm not sure.

[brithistorian.livejournal.com]

You're spot on to all of these!

And another one that I particular noticed during my days attending wargaming cons: If you get something on your hands, wash it off before touching anything. (Seriously, I wish I could find the genius who thought that selling popcorn, chili dogs, and nachos in a gaming room where people would be handling thousands of dollars worth of other people's toy soldiers was a good idea!)

[snuffkin.livejournal.com]

Oh god! What I hate most is the Them vs. Us thing. I joined a german Doctor Who forum and it's really awful. I think every new person there has to go through a year of constantly getting into fights with some of the older fans. The mood there is really awful :(
How many times did I have to listen to a speech about how wrong Fanfics are and that I'm just a psychotic, deluded Fangirl *shakeshead*

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

Damn, that's a bid sad, especially as I like to think that DW fans are usually the laid-back ones. Then again, I come from a Star Trek background, so I think I'm used to higher levels of hostility than the typical DW fan. :-/

(anyone who thinks ST fans all all luvvy-duvvy and IDIC haven't seen an *old* school fan going off about, well, everything else...)