Torchwood 1x08, They Keep Killing... - Further Thoughts

[fangrrl_squees]

I'm working off memory at the moment, so this might not be as in-depth as it could be.

Technical Bits
I'm quite happy with the look and feel of this episode. I thought the change in lighting direction for the Hub was refreshing and made the atmospherics of the lockdown a lot more effective. The slightly-yellow, definitely unflattering light, which had me thinking of documentaries on gloomy topics, was an excellent choice. Everyone looked a bit pale and washed out - not entirely unlike corpses. So, yeah, perhaps an obvious take on the photography, but a smart one, imho.

The effects were well-done. Susie's head looked gruesome but not so much as to get the Mary Whitehouse¹ crowd up in arms. Ditto for the cosmetics on Indira as Suzie progressed from three-months dead to practically reborn. Lovely!

As mentioned elsewhere, I'm feeling more charitable towards Mr. Strong (makes him sound like he should be red and square and wear a natty little hat, doesn't it?) as the direction wasn't nearly so ham-fisted this time around. It rather makes me wonder what was going on in the production team's head during 1x04, but I suppose that is a mystery for the ages.

The Story and The Characters
I liked it. I liked the fact that, once again, it's been illustrated how Torchwood seems to attract intelligent, well-meaning people and fuck them up. Doesn't bode well for Gwen, does it folks?

I really liked how the team tried everything else they could think of before resurrecting Suzie, rather than running for the morgue drawer as soon as her name was mentioned. There's some things, even these guys quail at. Hooray! Limits are important.

Survival at any cost is a theme that's going to resonate with viewers. We like to think that we're all atruistic, nice people at heart but, when push comes to shove, an awful lot of us (and I cheerfully include myself in this group) would pull a Winston-with-the-rats routine. Do it to someone else, not me. Disagree as you might with Suzie's methods, you can't fault her motive.

I know there are some complaints about how implausible it is for Suzie to have had that sort of plan all laid out in the event of her untimely demise. Clearly, these critics don't play RPGs. Well, not the same ones I do. I've been playing V:tM for over a decade and, believe me, complicated If I croak plans are pretty much the norm in those circles. Granted, they're more aimed at making sure you take some enemies down with you, albeit posthumously, or ensuring that your allies get their fair share of your 'stuff' but the plans existed, and some of the ones I've seen (or prepared) have Suzie looking like a piker. So I had no problem whatsoever with that plot point. The character has a dangerous job which shows every sign of ending in a nasty, unanticipated death. Darn tootin', I'd try to avoid that fate as much as possible!

However, I'll agree with the notion that it might have been asking for a bit too much suspension of disbelief from the majority of the audience. After all, they didn't spend two years playing a character so paranoid as to make Iosef Stalin look like St. Francis...

Gwen continues to be the well-meaning chump. I've accepted her in this role and, hell, I guess someone has to fill that niche. However, I notice that she's getting increasingly alarmed at the long-term implications of involvement with the organization. Nice of the guys to explain that up-front, huh? I'm hoping that the nascent alarm will develop into something a bit more tangible and, more to the point, that she tries to act on that alarm. Not by blowing the whistle on the organization or anything - as that's a quick way to a lifetime prescription of retcon (the name of which still makes me laugh) - but by changing it from within, or having the mother of all temper tantrums or something. Just, y'know, do something, woman! *ahem* Pardon me, maybe I haven't quite accepted Gwen as the well-meaning chump, after all.

I'm starting to think that maybe Jack is still a bit of a romantic, despite, er, whatever the hell has happened to him - it's a policy I've always maintained with rpg!Jack so, naturally, I'd like to see it on the show. However, like the rest of the team, it seems that he's not immune to making dumb decisions for what will probably be revealed as bad reasons. You think that the Jack/Ianto thing is going to end well? I don't. And I want lots of angsty hate-you/want-you sex along the way, but that's just me being greedy. Anyways, as I say, I'm wondering if Jack is a mad, desperate romantic, and just so severely burned by past experience/afraid of being burned that he's keeping it behind the cheerful-hedonist mask in order to protect himself. (Totally loved the "I had a boyfriend who used to enter rooms like that..." line. So much for the staff debate about is he/isn't he?)

And, incidentally, did anyone else think that Jack's dialog during the early scene in which he explained how the glove was found forty years ago strongly suggested that he was on site for that retreival? Just how long has that lad been hanging around Cardiff, anyway? And how many staffers has he seen come and go through the Hub? *metametameta*

I've encountered an oft-articulated sentiment that the Cardiff TW team are, frankly, a pack of incompetents who shouldn't be trusted to run a hot-dog stand, let alone a soopersekrit organization but, y'know, I like 'em a bit on the daft side. I'm sure that's because I very much believe in the axiom that the first thing a character should do is get into trouble. Granted, it might be nice to see 'em occasionally get whomped by something out of left field and deal with it handily, rather than it being either a largely self-created issue, or out of left-field and handled poorly but, well, maybe I'm expecting too much. If you want conflict, someone's going to be flawed, somewhere, or else you're stuck with a big pile of Mary Sue fic - and no comments about Rose's characterization, you lot!

I definitely want to watch this eps again and see how it bears up to a second viewing, which is more than I can say for Cyberwoman - which I made myself watch twice, just to confirm that, yep, it was that bad - or Small Worlds which, honestly, bored me to tears. Further mutterings as events warrant.

Incidentally, if you haven't stopped by there, torchwood_three is an excellent aggregation community for many things Torchwoodish on LJ-land and beyond.

¹ - is she even still alive?

Comments

[iko.livejournal.com]

1 - is she even still alive?

No. Thank goodness.

I rather liked how clever Suzie set it all up.
I didn't like how "oh! We all recognize Emily Dickinson and, *gasp* we even have the right volume of her poetry!" it all was, but outside of that, I thought it was fairly plausible.

As for the staff debate, I thought it was "is he gay? is he bi?" instead of "is he gay? is he not gay?" (is that what you're implying? Not sure). It's clear that he likes men. We need more Jack+female attraction (other than Carys). IMHO.

I am not convinced that Jack has been in Cardiff for a long period of time. No more than 5 years, just because of his connection established in Fairies. In fact, I would venture that Jack returned to Cardiff to a time just after the Doctor/Jack/Rose left Cardiff from the opened rift from Episode 1 and sort of... sat himself there. He knew the Doctor has been there and knows the Doctor may be back. Someday.

And yes, I like the flawed nature of the Torchwood characters. I agree that there has been some bad weak episodes (I'm looking at you, Cyberwoman) but the series still has so much potential.

[iko.livejournal.com]

Yow. I did that badly. Sowwie!

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

I got the gist :).

Maybe I'm just overeducated, but I thought using Emily Dickenson, especially that particular poem was a bit obvious, actually. But from what I've been reading, it seems that I'm in the minority with that one.

re: Jack and Cardiff... *shrugs* I dunno. I think it's plausible that he's been there for several decades, just he was better at keeping his head down - or (and this is probably more likely) he's been making a habit of stopping by frequently and now that he's solidly in the middle of an era during which the Doctor's known to pop up in Cardiff, he's staying closer to the rift.

IMHO, Jack's been careening around time since Satellite 5 and has probably drudged his way through many decades, if not centuries, before finally ending up somewhere that was 'close enough' (say, fifty years ago, 200 miles west) for him to wait it out to get to Cardiff 2006ish, rather than trying that rather dodgy time machine built from memory and parts scavenged off S5. ;)

[iko.livejournal.com]

It wasn't the poem that bothered me. It was the fact that within a few minutes, out of all the stuff in the storage facility, it was one of the first things pointed out and flipped through... and the detectives over the line managed to get the same version of that book. All of that stretched my willing suspension of disbelief. It's too clean and clear.

I'm willing to believe that Jack is very old (after all, how many times would you have to die before you're sort of... comfortable with the concept of dying to be confident that, yeap, you don't die, ever? The first few times, I'd be like "man, I am lucky!". Does Jack know he was dead and how could he, without outside input, know he was dead instead of merely passed out?). I'm just not convinced that he's been in Cardiff for a long period of time, since he would know when the Doctor/Jack/Rose were in Cardiff. I mean, I can throw lots of possibilities as to why Jack didn't reach out to the Doctor at the time, but I feel the simplest solution is that Torchwood!Jack wasn't there at the time.

It makes one think about Torchwood and Cardiff. Torchwood has been in Cardiff every since they discovered the Rift, so definitely pre-Cardiff events in S1E11. Thoughts on whether Jack was there at the time? I am guessing no, just because I would imagine there was prime opportunity for him to catch both Rose and the Doctor. But maybe Jack didn't want to be missing with his own timeline. I keep going towards the 'easier' answer -- he wasn't there at the time, which is why I would guess he arrived at Cardiff post-S1E11.

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

was the fact that within a few minutes, out of all the stuff in the storage facility, it was one of the first things pointed out

*shrug* I chalked it up to the downside of only having 39 minutes to tell the story in. As soon as Jack found the book in the shed, it might as well have had a big arrow pointing at it, bearing the label "Plot device!". I agree that it wasn't subtle, but, again, 39 minutes...

But maybe Jack didn't want to be missing with his own timeline.

And/Or was up to his ass in the proverbial alligators. Still 'tis a fair point. :)

[secretagentmoof]

In the anime Ouran High School Host Club, an arrow does in fact appear, blink, and beep for plot devices.

[bovil.livejournal.com]

As for the staff debate, I thought it was "is he gay? is he bi?"

I think the staff has no idea which of Jack's stories to believe because they're so outlandish. Gwen is the only one who knows for certain that his outlandish stories are probably true.

[ladykoori.livejournal.com]

Somewhere around lj yesterday I read a great post about how the fact that the team at Torchwood 3 is a bunch of misfits means that they won't fall like Torchwood 1 did. It was really interesting and now I can't find it again.

And everyone complaining about Suzie's in case of death plan makes no sense to me. I wonder if they're just being naive about that particular aspect of human nature. Personally I found it completely plausible and something that makes perfect sense for the character. My only issue with is it when it was set up. If it was set up before Gwen showed up in the picture at all then who exactly was Suzie thinking would be using the glove if none of the others in the group had been able to use it?

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

who exactly was Suzie thinking would be using the glove if none of the others in the group had been able to use it?

Every plan has a bit of a gamble in it - maybe that was Suzie's.

Or maybe Suzie was part of the conspiracy theory that I've seen bandied about on LJ, that brought Gwen in in the first place. She knew Gwen was coming and, well, we're still at a gamble...

Or maybe Suzie was just arrogant enough to believe that she'd be able to help out enough from the other side - so to speak - that as long as *someone* gave it the ol' college try, it would work.

On a much more irreverant note, was I the only person having filthy thoughts at the gamut of expressions on Jack's face when he tried to use the glove? ;)

[ladykoori.livejournal.com]

I've seen the Gwen conspiracy theory too which I buy into to an extent but I think it was a fairly short term thing instead of a long term thing that I've seen some speculation about.

I can certain see Suzie being arrogant and thinking she would be able to help.

And no, you weren't the only one with dirty thoughts about Jack's facial expressions.

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

And no, you weren't the only one with dirty thoughts about Jack's facial expressions.

Oh, thank goodness! I sometimes wonder if I take things too far. ;)

[dakron.livejournal.com]

It seem to me that Torchwood does have a real Dr Who feel to it. Gwen seems to be the Companion, who has to have things explained to her. Jack, and the rest of the gang are very much aspects of the Doctor.
At least, that's how it seems to me. Though, it is darker than Who, of course.

[lonelywalker.livejournal.com]

Just popped by compiling for torchwood_three today... thanks for the shout out! :-)

[fangrrl-squees.livejournal.com]

You're welcome! I've made the daily post over there part of my regular reading. It's a dam' sight easier than trawling through all the comms via an F-Filter.